Discussion:
Breathing Anti-freeze dangerous?
(too old to reply)
s***@gmail.com
2016-02-01 06:51:54 UTC
Permalink
Is breathing anti-freeze fumes dangerous?
My car has a leak in the heater core, thus the hot air smells like
anti-freeze. Can it stay like this for long with no ill effects?
How much do you drink??
The major anti-freeze component is ethylene glycol HOCH2-CH2OH. When introduced
into the human body, it is a substrate analog of ethanol and will be acted on
by the alchohol dehydrogenase (ADH) enzyme, which will convert it to HO2C-CO2H
(oxalic adic) over a few steps. Oxalic acid is poisonous.
But, if you drink lots of alcohol, a competitive inhibition "race" is started
between the ethylene glycol --> oxalic acid and the ethanol --> acetaldehyde
reactions, giving your body more time to purge the oxalic acid.
This is simular to the mechanism for methanol poinsoning (but the end product
is formaldehyde).
Note: I am an organic chemist -- any biochem types out there feel free to
add to/correct the above statements.
Oh, I would doubt that you are getting enough ethylene glycol to be dangerous,
but if you are getting hangovers after driving for a while, I would become
concerned. (Not to mention that anti-freeze hasn't been cheap since the
ethylene glycol plant blew up, but that is another story).
My grandson has been breathing fumes antifreeze fumes from heat core damage in jeep. My eyes would burn and it hurt my throat but I could not make my son or daughter in law believe it was injuring their son. He will soon be 6 and they finally believe he has problems without admitting it is from antifreeze. He can get uncontrollable in an instant without provocation. They think it is adhd. I think it goes further than than. where can I get more information. Pat (***@gmail.com)
dlzc
2016-02-01 14:29:50 UTC
Permalink
Dear ***@gmail.com:

On Sunday, January 31, 2016 at 11:51:59 PM UTC-7, ***@gmail.com wrote:
...
Post by s***@gmail.com
My grandson has been breathing fumes antifreeze
fumes from heat core damage in jeep. My eyes
would burn and it hurt my throat but I could not
make my son or daughter in law believe it was
injuring their son. He will soon be 6 and they
finally believe he has problems without admitting
it is from antifreeze.
They are very smart. There have been no environmental causes found to explain ADHD.
Post by s***@gmail.com
He can get uncontrollable in an instant without
provocation. They think it is adhd. I think it
goes further than [that].
Grandparents know everything, don't they?
Post by s***@gmail.com
where can I get more information. Pat
Ethylene glycol is made in large part by reacting a chemical used to sterilize medical goods (ethylene oxide gas, deadly poison), with glycerine. It is therefore cheap and toxic.

Marine antifreeze (propylene glycol) is more expensive, has different effects on elastomers, and is used in foodstuffs for consumption. You cannot always just switch over, and obviously fixing the coolant leak would be preferable.

http://healingtouch.areavoices.com/2013/02/27/a-deeper-connection-constipation-miralax-and-adhd/

You really should not hook into a 24-year-old thread, and expect too much attention. Best to start your own.

David A. Smith
Frank
2016-02-01 18:41:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by dlzc
...
Post by s***@gmail.com
My grandson has been breathing fumes antifreeze
fumes from heat core damage in jeep. My eyes
would burn and it hurt my throat but I could not
make my son or daughter in law believe it was
injuring their son. He will soon be 6 and they
finally believe he has problems without admitting
it is from antifreeze.
They are very smart. There have been no environmental causes found to explain ADHD.
Post by s***@gmail.com
He can get uncontrollable in an instant without
provocation. They think it is adhd. I think it
goes further than [that].
Grandparents know everything, don't they?
Post by s***@gmail.com
where can I get more information. Pat
Ethylene glycol is made in large part by reacting a chemical used to sterilize medical goods (ethylene oxide gas, deadly poison), with glycerine. It is therefore cheap and toxic.
Marine antifreeze (propylene glycol) is more expensive, has different effects on elastomers, and is used in foodstuffs for consumption. You cannot always just switch over, and obviously fixing the coolant leak would be preferable.
http://healingtouch.areavoices.com/2013/02/27/a-deeper-connection-constipation-miralax-and-adhd/
You really should not hook into a 24-year-old thread, and expect too much attention. Best to start your own.
David A. Smith
Looking over a current Aldrich SDS, it appears the toxicity of ethylene
glycol is overstated. I see the DOT classification is for an
environmental hazard but the main hazard would be dogs licking up
spills. Toxicity is such that according to original HAZCOM standard it
would not even be considered toxic. Also contact with food is OK.

I get that antifreeze smell from a leaking head gasket but do not think
it is EG because of the sweet smell, so it must be a decomposition product.

Don't confuse the non-chemist with the toxicity of ethylene oxide. EG
is the hydrolyzed product and can also be prepared directly from ethylene.
2***@nclusd.org
2016-02-18 02:16:29 UTC
Permalink
Actually I was in the school and antifreeze was spilling everywhere and I had an asthma attack
j***@gmail.com
2016-07-19 00:46:50 UTC
Permalink
But can breathing it kill you? I was outside applying coolant to an overheated car,though the coolant compartment had a leak so I applied it under the radiator cap.when I took the radiator cap off it was very hot. I held my breath and used a glove tk protect myself from the heat,but in the process of it spraying everywhere I moved away and took a breath. Shortly after I had a mild headache,thus happened 3 days ago. Am I going to die?
j***@gmail.com
2016-07-19 00:50:56 UTC
Permalink
But can breathing a small amount kill you? I was changing the coolant on an overheated car and the coolant compartment have a leak. So I continued to grab a glove to protect my hand from the heat of the radiator cap and unscrewed the cap. It released a major amount of pressure and Vapor in the air I stepped away. Though during the process I held my breath, but stepped away to finish letting the pressure out. But yeah I believe I inhaled a small amount in the process because shortly after I had a mild headache. So to the original question... am I going to die?
Peter Fairbrother
2016-07-19 15:53:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by j***@gmail.com
But can breathing a small amount kill you? I was changing the coolant
on an overheated car and the coolant compartment have a leak. So I
continued to grab a glove to protect my hand from the heat of the
radiator cap and unscrewed the cap. It released a major amount of
pressure and Vapor in the air I stepped away. Though during the
process I held my breath, but stepped away to finish letting the
pressure out. But yeah I believe I inhaled a small amount in the
process because shortly after I had a mild headache. So to the
original question... am I going to die?
Yes, you are going to die. We all do. But it is unlikely that breathing
a small amount of ethylene glycol spray will kill you.

If you think you inhaled more than half an ounce of liquid, or if you
are feeling drunk, weird, depressed, get advice and/or treatment RIGHT
THE FUCK NOW.

It can take a few days to kill you.


However that is a whole lot to inhale. Deaths from inhalation of spray
in these circumstances are almost non-existent, as people cough etc.

A lungful of vapour won't kill you [1], it's the spray which counts.


One antidote for minor levels of poisoning, if you are stock in the
middle of nowhere with no support, is alcohol. Unfortunately, the
initial-24hour effects of ethylene glycol poisoning are similar to those
of alcohol. Drink lots of water too.


BTW, the correct way to ask that sort of question is to phone your local
hospital, who will either advise you themselves, or connect you to a
poisons helpline.

I strongly advise you to do that - otherwise I take no responsibility
for this posting.

Plus, any other advice in it is directed only to the OP, if you aren't
him, and in his exact situation, it will not apply to you.


- Peter Fairbrother

[1] well it can, in extremely rare circumstances, but you'd already be
dead. it's onions! [2]

[2] one of the nerve gases, I forget which, is said to smell like onions
in certain concentrations. Unfortunately, those concentrations are
sufficient to kill in seconds, So, how do we know what it smells like?

I don't know, but imagining: someone opens bottle, takes a sniff, cries
"Onions!", falls down dead ..
Peter Fairbrother
2016-07-19 16:19:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Fairbrother
Post by j***@gmail.com
But can breathing a small amount kill you? I was changing the coolant
on an overheated car and the coolant compartment have a leak. So I
continued to grab a glove to protect my hand from the heat of the
radiator cap and unscrewed the cap. It released a major amount of
pressure and Vapor in the air I stepped away. Though during the
process I held my breath, but stepped away to finish letting the
pressure out. But yeah I believe I inhaled a small amount in the
process because shortly after I had a mild headache. So to the
original question... am I going to die?
Yes, you are going to die. We all do. But it is unlikely that breathing
a small amount of ethylene glycol spray will kill you.
If you think you inhaled more than half an ounce of liquid, or if you
are feeling drunk, weird, depressed, get advice and/or treatment RIGHT
THE FUCK NOW.
It can take a few days to kill you.
However that is a whole lot to inhale. Deaths from inhalation of spray
in these circumstances are almost non-existent, as people cough etc.
A lungful of vapour won't kill you [1], it's the spray which counts.
One antidote for minor levels of poisoning, if you are stock in the
middle of nowhere with no support, is alcohol. Unfortunately, the
initial-24hour effects of ethylene glycol poisoning are similar to those
of alcohol. Drink lots of water too.
Note especially - the drinking lots of water is for inhaled ethylene
glycol, after 12+ hours, and not for swallowed ethylene glycol!!!
Post by Peter Fairbrother
BTW, the correct way to ask that sort of question is to phone your local
hospital, who will either advise you themselves, or connect you to a
poisons helpline.
I strongly advise you to do that - otherwise I take no responsibility
for this posting.
Plus, any other advice in it is directed only to the OP, if you aren't
him, and in his exact situation, it will not apply to you.
- Peter Fairbrother
[1] well it can, in extremely rare circumstances, but you'd already be
dead. it's onions! [2]
[2] one of the nerve gases, I forget which, is said to smell like onions
in certain concentrations. Unfortunately, those concentrations are
sufficient to kill in seconds, So, how do we know what it smells like?
I don't know, but imagining: someone opens bottle, takes a sniff, cries
"Onions!", falls down dead ..
Frank
2016-07-19 17:13:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Fairbrother
Post by Peter Fairbrother
Post by j***@gmail.com
But can breathing a small amount kill you? I was changing the coolant
on an overheated car and the coolant compartment have a leak. So I
continued to grab a glove to protect my hand from the heat of the
radiator cap and unscrewed the cap. It released a major amount of
pressure and Vapor in the air I stepped away. Though during the
process I held my breath, but stepped away to finish letting the
pressure out. But yeah I believe I inhaled a small amount in the
process because shortly after I had a mild headache. So to the
original question... am I going to die?
Yes, you are going to die. We all do. But it is unlikely that breathing
a small amount of ethylene glycol spray will kill you.
If you think you inhaled more than half an ounce of liquid, or if you
are feeling drunk, weird, depressed, get advice and/or treatment RIGHT
THE FUCK NOW.
It can take a few days to kill you.
However that is a whole lot to inhale. Deaths from inhalation of spray
in these circumstances are almost non-existent, as people cough etc.
A lungful of vapour won't kill you [1], it's the spray which counts.
One antidote for minor levels of poisoning, if you are stock in the
middle of nowhere with no support, is alcohol. Unfortunately, the
initial-24hour effects of ethylene glycol poisoning are similar to those
of alcohol. Drink lots of water too.
Note especially - the drinking lots of water is for inhaled ethylene
glycol, after 12+ hours, and not for swallowed ethylene glycol!!!
Lot of info out there on ethylene glycol toxicity. This is probably as
good as any:

http://des.nh.gov/organization/commissioner/pip/factsheets/ard/documents/ard-ehp-12.pdf

OSHA standards would make it practically non-toxic but its sweet taste
can cause accidental consumption. Current GHS SDS standards make it
appear more toxic than it actually is:

http://www.sigmaaldrich.com/MSDS/MSDS/DisplayMSDSPage.do?country=US&language=en&productNumber=324558&brand=SIAL&PageToGoToURL=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.sigmaaldrich.com%2Fcatalog%2Fproduct%2Fsial%2F324558%3Flang%3Den
m***@gmail.com
2017-06-24 03:15:53 UTC
Permalink
What a stupid thing to say!
s***@gmail.com
2017-09-22 17:29:09 UTC
Permalink
I've been breathing anti freeze for two weeks because my Denali has some sort of leak. I became violently ill and vomiting. Stomach pain tiredness diarrhea. I felt like I was dying !! 😓
r***@goodone.lt
2018-01-03 13:35:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by s***@gmail.com
I've been breathing anti freeze for two weeks because my Denali has some sort of leak. I became violently ill and vomiting. Stomach pain tiredness diarrhea. I felt like I was dying !! 😓
What did you do? When did you get well? I feel like i'm having the same problem right now, feels like i'm just going to pass out all the time...
j***@goodone.lt
2018-01-03 13:38:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by s***@gmail.com
I've been breathing anti freeze for two weeks because my Denali has some sort of leak. I became violently ill and vomiting. Stomach pain tiredness diarrhea. I felt like I was dying !! 😓
What did you do to get well? I feel like i'm having the same problem..
s***@gmail.com
2017-10-21 02:08:06 UTC
Permalink
Safer than the gasoline in the car. You should be able to drink antifreeze
without any serious effects. Relax
no, no no don't drink anti freeze! It can kill you!
Libor 'Poutnik' Stříž
2017-10-21 08:03:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by s***@gmail.com
Safer than the gasoline in the car. You should be able to drink antifreeze
without any serious effects. Relax
no, no no don't drink anti freeze! It can kill you!
Someone may consider a warning after 26 years rather late..
--
Poutnik ( The Pilgrim, Der Wanderer )

A wise man guards words he says,
as they say about him more,
than he says about the subject.
d***@gmail.com
2019-05-12 20:50:42 UTC
Permalink
Safer than the gasoline in the car. You should be able to drink antifreeze
without any serious effects. Relax
That's WRONG. Please remove this post before you get someone killed. You should NEVER drink antifreeze. It is poisonous and even a small dose can prove lethal.
g***@gmail.com
2019-10-30 23:05:37 UTC
Permalink
My 96 Dodge Ram heater core has small pin holes in it I can smell it it's on my windows how harmful is this to me over one winter
d***@gmail.com
2020-05-22 20:08:24 UTC
Permalink
Nearly passed out driving back from a long drive at work in 96 Dodge ram 2500 dually with a heater core leak. Quit a few days later after company refused to let repair shop fix it, because of costs. Employer denied unemployment benefits for quiting without good cause. So according to the Missouri department of labor, it is not dangerous or a hazard to our health, but what the hell does a pencil pusher know!
v***@at.BioStrategist.dot.dot.com
2020-07-06 05:26:05 UTC
Permalink
I think it competes with hemoglobin for oxygen.

I seem to recall ethylene glycol is used as a blood substitute in vitro.


- = -
Vasos Panagiotopoulos, Columbia'81+, Reagan, Mozart, Pindus
blog: panix.com/~vjp2/ruminatn.htm - = - web: panix.com/~vjp2/vasos.htm
facebook.com/vasjpan2 - linkedin.com/in/vasjpan02 - biostrategist.com
---{Nothing herein constitutes advice. Everything fully disclaimed.}---
g***@gmail.com
2019-10-30 23:03:48 UTC
Permalink
My 96 Dodge Ram heater core has been lightly spraying the inside of my windows with a light smog herb antifreeze is this harmful to my health over a. Of a one winter
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