In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 29 Sep 2023 05:20:47 -0400, Bradley
Post by BradleyPost by Cindy HamiltonPost by BradleyI just noticed this oven has a "self cleaning" feature, which, I think,
That was going to be my question. Why are you screwing around with
ammonia when you can just use the self-cleaning feature? I haven't
seen an oven without self-clean in about 30 years.
People who use self-cleaning features of ovens
I don't use the oven much and as I said, I've used self-cleaning a bunch
of times, maybe 6 times in 40 years. How much environmental damage does
6 times do in comparison to everything else I do? We're only
suggesting to you that you use it once.
Post by Bradleyand then they cry about
global warming
I don't cry about global warming. I think we've already lost the battle
and there will be dire consequences. We can delay them somewhat, but I
don't dicuss it.
Post by Bradleyare why I don't plan on using the self-cleaning feature.
Post by Cindy HamiltonPost by BradleyAnyone use the self cleaning feature?
Does it work?
Yes, and yes. Your oven might be too far gone for the self-clean
feature to be effective.
I just read the Consumer Reports on self-cleaning ovens. They say it works,
but there are a lot of indications that it breaks the ovens too.
Below you say 1%. How is this not like incandescent light bulbs that
burn out when you turn them on. Does that mean turning on a light bulb
burns it out? It's just the straw that breaks the camel's back.
Post by BradleyConsumer Reports specifically said one percent of the ovens break down due
to the self cleaning feature being used.
Post by Cindy HamiltonPost by BradleyIf I admit that, you'll think I haven't been maintaining the home.
You haven't been maintaining the oven if it's crusted up with burned
food.
That's a good thing.
It's like you telling me I haven't wasted our precious water watering my
lawn or washing my car or taking three or four baths a day.
Not wasting resources is a good thing.
This is a popular response technique. I don't know if it's listed in
the list of logical fallacies, but it should be. That is:
Cindy writes about one specific thing that you consider *wasting*
resources, and you reply about any sort of extra use of resources, as if
Cindy had written about the group of them.
Post by BradleyYou seem to think it's a bad thing.
And here you do it again. Cindy said nothing of the sort.
And who says that it's wasting? Why is it wasting anymore than any
other use of resources? YOU are the one complaining about caked on dirt
on your oven. If you or the previous owner had cleaned it more often,
it wouldn't be like that. So it's failure to use resources, either Easy
Off and human effort or Self-cleaning, that created the problem you are
complaining about. --- So now the question is, is using self-cleaning
worse for moral or environmental reasons, without corresponding benefit,
than cleaning it by hand. Should one drive downtown when he can drive
to a bus-stop and take a bus? Should one drive to a city an hour away
when he can drive to the bus station and take a bus? May one mow the
lawn with a power lawn mower or must he use a manual one?
Should one accept a job that requires driving a car 60 minutes when
he could take a worse job that is 30 minutes away?
There are hundreds of such questions involving use of resources.
Post by BradleyIt's not.
It's a good thing.
It's like a BBQ.
It's _supposed_ to be all black.
What? You were the one who started this by complaining about it,
weren't you?
And no, the oven is not supposed to be black inside. In the best
possible world, it would look like it did when it was new.
Post by BradleyPost by Cindy HamiltonPost by BradleyThe reason I cleaned it is a woman had all four limbs amputated recently in
the news because she ate uncooked tilapia fish so I wanted to put a
I think the moral of that story is: don't eat tilapia. It's nasty
stuff. Spend a little more on fish that doesn't eat poop (when no
other source of nutrition is available).
First I heard about this, Cindy. I thought if you cooked the fish until
the translucent flesh turned white, that was enough. ??????
Post by BradleyYou can tell others to waste their money - but I don't waste anything.
I'm sure you do. I too try not to waste anything. My parents grew up
poor and I was raised that way. But it's inevitable. Even my parents
ended up wasting sometimes.
Do you wash dishes under running water, instead of using a dishpan
filled with water and soap and another for rinsing? Washing under
running water is wasteful.
Do you use the dish washer for mildly dirty dishes without a full
dishwasher. This requires algebra and 4 variables but sometiems it's
wasteful to use the dishwasher, certainly if it's not full. I think
sometimes it's the opposite of wasteful but I'm not sure.
Post by BradleyI use the bones of the Tilapia as one of the layers of my fertilizer.
And yes, the fertilizer has _all_ the components that it should have.
Pee. Poop. Kitchen scraps. And Tilapia.
If you don't make your own fertilizer, then you are wasting our resources
becaue you have to use Nitrogen made by the Bessler process.
Which is something only Republicans can afford to do.
LOL
Post by BradleyAnd which is something only Democrats lie about saying they don't do it.
ROTFLOL
Post by BradleyBear in mind, both Democrats and Republicans are liars.
They just lie in different ways.
The Democrats waste our resources but they cry about it.
The Republicans waste our resources but they don't care about it.
You can choose which one you are - but I'm neither.
I don't waste our resources if I don't have to.
Post by Cindy HamiltonPost by BradleyAnyone know what's the best chemical to clean an oven?
It has black baked on crud everywhere.
I suppose you can't jump in a time machine and properly maintain the
oven to begin with.
You seem to think this "proper maintenenance" matters.
It doesn't.
You clean it when it gets dirty.
Just like you clean your penis.
There is a recent notion that if one uses the "proper" medical term for
a person's private parts it's acceptable to discuss them in mixed
company. That is not true. It's a degradation of society not to use a
euphemism.
Post by BradleyPost by Cindy HamiltonBuy some oven cleaner. That's what it's for. It's formulated to
stick to the oven walls while it works.
Again. Oven Cleaner is a waste of resources.
It's 1% lye and 99% wasteful crap that goes into the atmosphere.
When you use soap, it all goes down the drain. Isnt that wasteful?
Post by BradleyI'll make my own lye with table salt in water plus two carbon electrodes
and a 12VDC car battery if I have to but I'm not wasting our precious
resources on highly marketed and packaged 1% ingredients like you suggest.
Post by Cindy HamiltonDon't try heating the oven while Easy Off is in there.
Consumer Reports suggested using ammonia but they also suggested not using
too much because then the liquid spills down the _inside_ of the door
glass, which is EXACTLY what happened to me when I used to much of it.
That was Cindy's point, "[Oven cleane is] formulated to stick to the
oven walls while it works."
Post by BradleyThey also recommend leaving the ammonia inside in a non-aluminum bowl,
to loosen the crud - which is what I'm doing now - so the fumes work.
They also said when you use the wasteful oven cleaner, it can kill your
birds,
Goo to know, but I don't have any birds (and I use self-cleaning)
Post by Bradleyand it can create carbon monoxide which can kill you so you need to
keep a few windows open - which in the winter will waste even more energy.
In the winter, the heat of self-cleaning means your furnace doesn't run
as much.
Post by BradleyPeople who waste energy should be Republicans because then they're not
liars because Republicans don't care. Democrats say they care. But they
lie.
Note that I'm being hard on both Democrats and Republicans to make the
point that anyone who uses the oven cleaner and who _then_ cries about the
environment is being duplicitous and therefore not true to their own words.
Baloney. Being inconsisstent is not the same as being duplicitous, and
in the cases you're describing the inconsistency is accidental, so it's
even farther from duplicitous.
